BTW Martin check out C preferreds today - I bought some C-W and C-E a couple days ago.  They are 5th and 6th down the line of preferreds that might be converted to C if not enough C preferred people tender their shares, which I think is a strong possibility (and confirmed by some experienced people who told me about it).  They have 40% upside right now and even if they don't get tendered, they have strong yields.